Yet another update on ID
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Due to recent events a huge German political magazine wrote a long article about ID. Actually they wrote about this subject in September already, which might have been the reason why CDU politician and Minister President of Thüringen Dieter Althaus cancelled his invitation to micro biologist and author Siegfried Scherer to speak at a political discussion forum next year.
Scherer is the most famous German follower of ID, although he claims not to be any more.
Up until 2003 he was a member of the Discovery Institute in Seattle. Now he renounces them, and distances himself from their plans to force ID into the schools’ lesson plans. On the other hand he is busy with sowing doubt against the Theory of Evolution in his role as chairman of the Studiengemeinschaft Wort und Wissen (study community Word and Knowledge). He is convinced that the Fall of Man caused our mortality. Had Eve not made Adam eat that apple we would still be immortal. Oh, and all the animals too.
The magazine also published the results of a poll:
13% of the Germans believe that God created Man and the world in 6 days
23% believe that God or another higher being guided evolution along its way
60% believe in evolution without any divine influence
Results by region, creed and school type:
God created Man and the world:
14% in West Germany
8% in East Germany
14% of Protestants
17% of Catholics
5% of people without creed
28% from Hauptschule (lowest level of education)
14% from Realschule (medium level of education)
4% from Gymnasium/Hochschule (highest level of education)
God or similar helped evolution along:
25% in West Germany
14% in East Germany
26% of Protestants
29% of Catholics
11% of people without creed
22% from Hauptschule
19% from Realschule
27% from Gymnasium/Hochschule
Evolution without divine interference:
57% in West Germany
73% in East Germany
54% of Protestants
50% of Catholics
80% of people without creed
43% from Hauptschule
63% from Realschule
67% from Gymnasium/Hochschule
And at the end let’s go back to where it all came from: America.
In Pennsylvania the mother of a 16 year old girl is suing the school.
Her goal: Nothing but her constitutional rights. The American constitution bans religion from schools (separation of church and state).
Her reasons: Growing uneasiness about the changes at her daughter’s school, climaxing in utter dread and terror when her daughter came home from school, screaming at her: Why do you believe in evolution? What kind of Christian are you? Why did you teach me all those lies? Evolution is a lie!
This she had learned from her friends and - yes - in school.
I call that brainwashing. They’re brainwashing the children, so that the new generations will all be followers of ID.
And they don’t want to stop just there. (As if this wasn’t enough already.) Here’s some other things they’d like to get rid off:
- sex education right along with Darwinism and Theory of evolution
- homosexuals
- abortion
- atheism
- materialism
I only hope the judges will rule in favour of the plaintiff.
I’m not having very high hopes though. If even the funny monkey, er, President of the United States is violating the constitution by supporting the teaching of ID at schools, what is there to expect, really…?
November 17th, 2005 at 12:03 pm
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…wonder where you got all this info…? ;o)
soikk?
November 18th, 2005 at 8:06 am
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Hello Melantrys, I read your comment to Najma regarding hijab and decided to check out your blog.
This post about ID is quite interesting! As I stopped believing in supernatural beings around the age of eleven, I long ago discounted all the various creation myths of the world’s many religions (although, some of them do make for entertaining reading). I do not consider evolution to be a mere theory. I consider it to be proven fact. There are, I believe, various hypotheses regarding exactly how evolution works. However, as far as I know, there are no real scientists that doubt that evolution is real. Some scientists, though, are religious. So, it is not a surprise to me that some might believe that a higher being had a hand in guiding evolution. Even I do not discount the possibility that some sort of highly intelligent extraterrestrial beings might have visited Earth in the past and meddled with some animal’s or prehistoric hominid’s genome. If the many UFO buffs are right, then perhaps we are still being visited and meddled with. In any case, I am against the teaching of “intelligent design” in schools. There is no testable proof that either a supernatural or a natural being was ever involved with the existence or with the evolution of life on earth. The belief in ID is based not on facts but on faith. Therefore, ID is a religious belief. In the U.S., it is not currently permissible to promote a particular religious agenda in the public schools. However, if Bush and his fundamentalist friends get their way with judicial appointments, Thomas Jefferson’s “wall of separation between Church and State” could crumble and fall. I hope that will not happen!
Btw, this post was far from useless! Thanks for writing it!
November 18th, 2005 at 8:11 am
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And thank you for your comment.
Here, we have religion courses at school, as you might have noticed in another post of mine. The last teach I had there was also promoting that evolution alone was too big a thing to happen without God giving it a little leg up at the beginning. Apart from that he always taught that the bible should be understood as a parable and not taken literally.
November 18th, 2005 at 10:46 am
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TEH MEL IS A SEXAY MAMMA!
November 18th, 2005 at 11:34 am
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IF THE MOUNTAIN WILL NOT COME TO MOHAMMED, MOHAMMED WILL GO TO THE MOUNTAIN - “If one cannot get one’s own way, one must adjust to the inevitable. The legend goes that when the founder of Islam was asked to give proofs of his teaching, he ordered Mount Safa to come to him. When the mountain did not comply, Mohammed raised his hands toward heaven and said, ‘God is merciful. Had it obeyed my words, it would have fallen on us to our destruction. I will therefore go to the mountain and thank God that he has had mercy on a stiff-necked generation.’ The saying has been traced back in English to ‘Essays,’ (1625) by English philosopher Frances Bacon (1561-1626). It was included in John Ray’s book of English proverbs in 1678. First attested in the United States in ‘Jonathan Belcher Papers’ (1733). In German, the phrase translates as ‘Wenn der Berg nicht zum Propheten kommt, muß der Prophetzum Berg kommen.” From “Random House Dictionary of Popular Proverbs and Sayings” (1996) by Gregory Y. Titelman (Random House, New York, 1996).
My interpretation is of course that certain stupid Christians should accept that the Bible isn’t the all and complete truth, but those very same Christians would interpret it as that I should accept intelligent design.
aiykv!!!! Die by this karate-scream of me evil stupid Christians!!!
November 18th, 2005 at 6:57 pm
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I disagree somewhat with David’s point that he considers evolution to be proven fact. The statement is too broad, and the issue really is what does one mean by the term “evolution.” The ID theory is interesting to me, not because I “believe” it, but because it is simply interesting to consider. ID is a bit like evolution, the real issue is what does one mean by using the term “ID”. The purpose of my comment is to caution you about lumping ID as a bible thumper’s wedge to use to enter the school system. Such a notion is akin to lumping persons wanting to explore and expand evolutionary theory as atheists who want to convert everyone to atheism. Sure ID is used by bible thumpers, and evolution is used by atheists, but neither is the whole story. Here is a link to someone who is pushing ID. I wish that I could have found a better one, but this is the best that I can do on short notice. http://www.ankerberg.com/Articles/science/creation-questions/SC-creation-questions.htm It isn’t great reading, but I think that if you persist through the article, you might understand that there is more to ID than what you seem to think from your post.
November 18th, 2005 at 7:17 pm
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ID is just a new name for Creationism. Plus they spiced it up a bit.
As I said in my other comment, some people believe that God helped evolution along. Fine by me. I can accept that as valid, even if I can’t agree.
But whether you call it Creationism or Intelligent Design, it’s about brainwashing people. On my first research round I came across a lot of forums where young people were promoting ID. Religiously fanatic aggressive lunatics the lot of them.
Maybe the theory attracts normal, not fanatical people as well, but the movers and shakers are.
And by the way…. even the Pope accepts the Theory of Evolution as valid.
November 18th, 2005 at 8:28 pm
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The biggest problem that I have with ID and teaching it in schools is: who teaches it? what is the source material?
Do we simply put forth that things are just too orderly to have been a fluke so therefore someone or something must have done it? It appears to me that the only evidence that can be used to back this up is faith. And how do you teach faith? Who teaches it? Do you expect the same people who studied science in college to suddenly start teaching faith? This is a recipe for failure. Do you have this teacher step down for a few days per year and call in a local priest, rabbi or minister for those days?
I would be interested in seeing how this is to be applied for real.
Good stuff, Melantrys. Keep writing.
November 19th, 2005 at 7:00 am
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like i always say, mel is one smart and sexy mamma!
everybody agrees i’m sure.